First off I would like to say that the forums do not contain every member of the WoW population, they are a representation. The forums are here for us to discuss the issues we have with certain aspects of the game and occasionally get a response from a developer to let us know that our voices are being heard.

Now I have read a fair few posts about the new forms and can see that there are mixed views. Some people love them, some people hate them, some people like some parts of them but dislike other parts, and some people want the implementation to be changed.

The people posting their views on these forums often make very valid points and so I find it hard to believe when people flame at others for saying their opinion, given that it is just that. Their opinion.

For example, there are several posts about how people want the forms to be changed slightly or the implementation changed. And the replies from many people are 'Don't complain' and 'Don't be so ungrateful'. Well, the thing is I don't think those people are ungrateful, I think that they are happy that this moment has come, given the topic itself has been one of important discussion for so long, HOWEVER they do not think that the current status of the forms is the best it could be.

I also think that they don't want the patch to come with something they are not entirely happy with. I think they are perfectly justified in saying whether they like the forms or not. After all, they do not want to be given something they are not happy with.

There currently is big news about the new forms and word spreads quickly from these forums to the game when something like this occurs. So it is clear that they are about to be implemented very soon, which to many people means 'something is finally being done!' And it is clear to me that people want this something to be just right. That is why there are so many opinions flying back and forth.

They do not want 'the something' to be one they don't like and live in the hope that it may be changed in the future. They want 'the something' to be implemented correctly, first time round, knowing that it may be another 4/5 years before another change is made.

In this thread here: http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=9521443273&sid=1&pageNo=1

Wryxian's reply to most people's negative comments was

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Q u o t e:
I think it's important to see the new forms as what they are: a range of new models and skins that you can choose from in some way. Let's not forget that Druids have been requesting new or re-worked forms for a very long time, and now they are almost here.

Rather than potentially delaying their release by working on new or updated functions for the barbershop, we've instead got a simple way of choosing which of the new models you want. This seems to me to be a first step, much like the appearance of the barbershop with the initial selection of new hairstyles was. Now that the first step is about to be made for new forms, who knows what we might do in the future to allow Druids to choose from these models in a way other than how we currently intend to implement them.

Seems more important, at least in my eyes, that the new forms are no longer in the "new forms is something we would like to do sometime" status, and have now actually been seen by the community and are much closer to actually being in-game than ever before.

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While some parts I agree with, I think that when people requested new forms they did not intend on having to change their hair/skin colour in order to get a form colour which they liked, and so this has come as a bit of a shock. I also think that some people did not want to be pink or have necklaces or have beards or sideburns or big heads but then again some people did.

The point is that people were EXPECTING more customization and a swish new way of it being implemented i.e a barber shop etc. and so this has also come as a shock to those too. So people have made their posts displaying their opinions and many of them are very similar as lots of people want the same thing. It also seems to me that their voices are being ignored and the original implementation is going ahead as usual, DESPITE the sheer volume of equally minded protests.

I would like to bring your attention back to the Blue post which says:

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Q u o t e:
This seems to me to be a first step, much like the appearance of the barbershop with the initial selection of new hairstyles was. Now that the first step is about to be made for new forms, who knows what we might do in the future to allow Druids to choose from these models in a way other than how we currently intend to implement them.

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Something which stands out to me is the part which says:

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Q u o t e:
who knows what we might do in the future

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And THAT'S the crucial point. In the future. The reason for most of the negative opinions of the implementation and new designs is that people want it to be good NOW, first time round. They are not ungrateful. Far from it in fact. They are trying their best to let blizzard know how and on what they should improve upon, as this is one of, if not THE most important change druids have ever had. People are worried that if the new forms go live now - it will be much more difficult to change once implemented and therefore less likely to happen.

I apologise for the long post; I did not mean to write as much as this but I wanted to make sure that people understood WHY there are so many posts and negative feedback on this, and hopefully make them see things from a different point of view.

I will also hope that Blizzard reads this and may consider the points many people raise BEFORE the new forms go live, and to bear in mind whether: if the new forms DO go ahead as planned, and people want some changes to be made, will there actually be any within in a sensible amount of time, or will there be another 4 year wait?

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Q u o t e:

And THAT'S the crucial point. In the future. The reason for most of the negative opinions of the implementation and new designs is that people want it to be good NOW, first time round. They are not ungrateful. Far from it in fact. They are trying their best to let blizzard know how and on what they should improve upon, as this is one of, if not THE most important change druids have ever had. People are worried that if the new forms go live now - it will be much more difficult to change once implemented and therefore less likely to happen.

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I'm sorry but I've seen people state they Blizzard "ruined" their catform. That IS being ungrateful. I have no problems with people who suggest changes. I personally hope they let us pick the skins ourselves and also give is an option to not show the nosering / necklace for example. THAT is feedback. THAT is the kind of suggestions the devs are looking for. "OMG THIS IS TERRIBLE" and "FU THIS IS GHEY" are the ones I'm pretty allergic to. If I wanted to read "FU BLIZZARD" posts I'd go read the PvP forum.

glad you see it the way i do,
great post

however, if they would have delayed the released of new forms, in any way,
a big mob would have lynched them
so i understand why Bliz has decided to take the actions they took.

cba to read all that.

I think it's a missed opportunity. Chances are we'll never see them change again and for them to end up looking like they do it's a shame.

If these Nelf cat ones go live then they WILL ruin my cat form, and I'd much rather have the option of saying, "Thanks, but no thanks" - and keep what I have. The only hope for change is for people to complain as much as they can now, because once this goes live - who knows when and if they will expand on it/change stuff.

They say they will, but heck, look how long it took the first time.

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Q u o t e:
If these Nelf cat ones go live then they WILL ruin my cat form, and I'd much rather have the option of saying, "Thanks, but no thanks" - and keep what I have. The only hope for change is for people to complain as much as they can now, because once this goes live - who knows when and if they will expand on it/change stuff.

They say they will, but heck, look how long it took the first time.

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This.


@ Sam
Additionally, saying someone is ungrateful for having an opinion is very arrogant and patronizing. Shame on you.

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Q u o t e:
We do bear (apt word, by the way) all the feedback in mind, I assure you. The artwork has been previewed, a description of the current intention for implementing the artwork in-game has been given, but this is all in advance of testing on the PTR and bearing in mind feedback. Most everything we preview is done so with a cautionary air of "subject to change before going live" and, with the nature of MMO development as it is, is "subject to change after going live" also.

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Did you know that 'bear' is a slang term for homosexual. Just thought i'd throw that out there without any insinuation of homophobia on my part.. i'm just giving a impartial reference to a slang term used by the gay community i believe.

Here's a google link for your enjoyment!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6hi6yfgOclw

Hopefully i won't get trolled for that!

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Q u o t e:
We do bear (apt word, by the way) all the feedback in mind, I assure you. The artwork has been previewed, a description of the current intention for implementing the artwork in-game has been given, but this is all in advance of testing on the PTR and bearing in mind feedback. Most everything we preview is done so with a cautionary air of "subject to change before going live" and, with the nature of MMO development as it is, is "subject to change after going live" also.

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But I do hope you listen BOTH sides. Not only the ones, who say : nerf/we do not like, but also people, who adore things. I.e. latest trend of pink catform. I would be disappointed, when it become removed. Its one of best models next to the dark night elf cat.

Do not just listen the vocal negativity, but more silent support.

Being a game developer myself I understand the difficulties of giving more customisation options than the one suggested so far (link in form colours with hair/mane colours). And I have to say I would very much rather get the change in its current form now (and enjoy the new forms) and have it improved later on than wait who knows how much longer to get the forms with bells and whistles attached.

I am sure further features will be added to the game as time goes by. Just compare WoW now to the original release. Northrend and Outland are clear examples that WoW does get expanded so I am sure the forms will get more options attached to them, but maybe not this patch. It is still a good step forward IMO because the new form models are just much better than the old ones. Maybe not from a colouring perspective, whatever (although I love them as they are), but they are at least a lot more detailed and nicer to look at.

Ultimately I think that some stuff should not be decided by the players really. We do not get the option to decide the lore and storyline and rightly so. We shouldn't be allowed to change the art direction of the game either. I want to experience WoW as Blizzard intended it - if I wanted a game in which druids' forms looked differently from what Blizzard's artists make them, then that would no longer be a Blizzard game or a Warcraft game. But right now I want to play WoW - by Blizzard Entertainment Inc.

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Q u o t e:


But I do hope you listen BOTH sides. Not only the ones, who say : nerf/we do not like, but also people, who adore things. I.e. latest trend of pink catform. I would be disappointed, when it become removed. Its one of best models next to the dark night elf cat.

Do not just listen the vocal negativity, but more silent support.

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Most of the negative remarks don't have anything to do with the pure pink (maybe its red) cat. But people are pretty sensitive about the black cat and the white cat. And that one on the left having a pink tone in the face.

Ceradyn i honestly don't mind having one pink cat and one pink bear - i just think the black and white cats look silly / repulsive and that's a problem for others as well.

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Q u o t e:
Being a game developer myself I understand the difficulties of giving more customisation options than the one suggested so far (link in form colours with hair/mane colours). And I have to say I would very much rather get the change in its current form now (and enjoy the new forms) and have it improved later on than wait who knows how much longer to get the forms with bells and whistles attached.

I am sure further features will be added to the game as time goes by. Just compare WoW now to the original release. Northrend and Outland are clear examples that WoW does get expanded so I am sure the forms will get more options attached to them, but maybe not this patch. It is still a good step forward IMO because the new form models are just much better than the old ones. Maybe not from a colouring perspective, whatever (although I love them as they are), but they are at least a lot more detailed and nicer to look at.

Ultimately I think that some stuff should not be decided by the players really. We do not get the option to decide the lore and storyline and rightly so. We shouldn't be allowed to change the art direction of the game either. I want to experience WoW as Blizzard intended it - if I wanted a game in which druids' forms looked differently from what Blizzard's artists make them, then that would no longer be a Blizzard game or a Warcraft game. But right now I want to play WoW - by Blizzard Entertainment Inc.

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^ what he said.

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Q u o t e:
Being a game developer myself I understand the difficulties of giving more customisation options than the one suggested so far (link in form colours with hair/mane colours). And I have to say I would very much rather get the change in its current form now (and enjoy the new forms) and have it improved later on than wait who knows how much longer to get the forms with bells and whistles attached.

I am sure further features will be added to the game as time goes by. Just compare WoW now to the original release. Northrend and Outland are clear examples that WoW does get expanded so I am sure the forms will get more options attached to them, but maybe not this patch. It is still a good step forward IMO because the new form models are just much better than the old ones. Maybe not from a colouring perspective, whatever (although I love them as they are), but they are at least a lot more detailed and nicer to look at.

Ultimately I think that some stuff should not be decided by the players really. We do not get the option to decide the lore and storyline and rightly so. We shouldn't be allowed to change the art direction of the game either. I want to experience WoW as Blizzard intended it - if I wanted a game in which druids' forms looked differently from what Blizzard's artists make them, then that would no longer be a Blizzard game or a Warcraft game. But right now I want to play WoW - by Blizzard Entertainment Inc.

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Yeah, I can fully agree with that. The game has much improved, so has been dealing with player feedback in general. Much more streamlimed and faster than in the beginning days. Also being a former game developer myself I can see in what situation they might be in - a feat coming from experience with similar-looking issues.

new forms are great! good job blizzard :) I'm very happy for the looks of them and I hope to be a white kitty/bear

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Q u o t e:
I'm sorry but I've seen people state they Blizzard "ruined" their catform. That IS being ungrateful. I have no problems with people who suggest changes. I personally hope they let us pick the skins ourselves and also give is an option to not show the nosering / necklace for example. THAT is feedback. THAT is the kind of suggestions the devs are looking for. "OMG THIS IS TERRIBLE" and "FU THIS IS GHEY" are the ones I'm pretty allergic to. If I wanted to read "FU BLIZZARD" posts I'd go read the PvP forum.

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Lumping any negative feedback into a "monosyllabic mouth-breathing lolkids" bin is, plain and simple, rude. There have been many reasonable posts and suggestions from people who do not like aspects of the new forms.

And for the record: it's only the new night elf cat form I take exception to, but in that case, it's strong exception. I think the others are great. So please don't say everyone who says they can't stand say the new elf cat is simply a negative whiner who refuses to see anything good in anything Blizzard does.

3.2 will ruin catform for me. Also, I really fail to understand why I should be "grateful" considering I never asked for, much less demanded a form upgrade, and will not have an option to decline. I'm fine with the current forms. Even the deranged train wreck-faced bear.

(Again, can we at least, please, have the darkest green hair color map to the same forms as the dark blue? It baffles me why all three different greens are lumped into one when the blues aren't.)

I find the new models very good, I really like them a lot.

The only concern I have, is about the fact that the hair color in NE form is linked to the color of the forms.

To avoid the only thing that I don't really like about the new forms, that is one of their colors.... I need to change the hairs of my character.

I will like to be able to choose the color of the cat/bear, and not to have to choose a look that doesn't satisfy me fully either in cat form or in NE form.

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Q u o t e:
3.2 will ruin catform for me. Also, I really fail to understand why I should be "grateful" considering I never asked for, much less demanded a form upgrade, and will not have an option to decline. I'm fine with the current forms. Even the deranged train wreck-faced bear.

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Going to be a bit cheeky and post a personal opinion here, hope you don't take offence in what I am about to say - really don't mean it that way. Feel free to disagree with me.

I think a lot of the problems of online games right now (and not just games, online services in general) is that people mistake the relationship between them (the users of the service) and the developers of said service to a relationship of servitude. In no way is Blizzard bound by anything to answer to your demands or listen to what you ask for. It is their game, their creation, their work of art, if you will, why should they listen to what you have to say about it?

I think it is commendable that they do listen (some developers are just happy to chuck a game on the shelves and forget about it) but I don't think it is right for us to demand anything. Suggest, maybe, yes. But ultimately it is their decision. If they decided to make the cats glowy green with red spots because they think it fits better with the lore I think we should just respect that decision for what it is - them expressing their artistic visions within the game. It doesn't mean we have to agree with it being a good idea, of course, but what I mean is that ultimately we shouldn't demand anything because we do not have that right.