Elemental shields in Elemental shield is kinda out-dated. It REDUCES the chance of getting a Eye of the storm procc, with all the resillience in the game now-a-days its kinda useless.

Toughness is also outdated, should be replaced with something rather usefull.

Resto
And resto only!.

One of the things i find odd about talent tree is 'the lack' of a proper raid build as Healing shaman.

http://www.wow-europe.com/en/info/basics/talents/shaman/talents.html?0000000000000000000050000000000000000000055230051050310510321
these are the talents i consider important as key talents, but it leaves 14 points for? ... random stuff.

Healing Grace
Threat isn't really a issue in raid, can be argued that it is in 5man group, but well, i havn't had problems with aggro in a 5man heroic when solo healing. Threat only seems to be a problem when stuff is running around loose without any to tank it, or with a poor tank.

Totemic Focus
So normal totem setups
Strength (300mana), Random Fire (300mana), Mana spring (120mana), Windfury (325mana),
Total 1045mana. Every 2minute. Thats 43mp5. Talented 5/5 its 32mp5. 11mana per 5.

Strength (300mana), Flame Tongue (325mana), Mana Spring (120mana), Grace of Air (310mana)
Total 1055mana. Every 2minute. Thats 44mp5. Talented 5/5 its 33mp5. 11mana per 5.

I honestly don't think that 5 talent points is this little mana savings worth. It would be worth 2 points, but not 5, however what else to put them into?
What else to put them into?

Nature's Guidance
Nothing to do with healing at all.

Tidal Mastery
Well, yes this talent will increase your healing. however, i cannot rely on my healing to crit, and ideal, if my heal crits, it will over heal. Of course its 'nice' when it crits and its needed. But 5 talent points for 'nice' ? .. meh seems more like candy to get elementals to come into resto tree.

Focused mind
Erhm 15%?... Anyway... limited use pve wise...

Nature's Guardian
This talent is so imba in pvp, and low end raiding (Where mobs doesn't 1-2 hit you)
However, very limited use while raiding.

So this leaves us with 14 talents to spend on?, random stuff?... Sure we could go for lots of stuff. But they wont really help us while raiding.

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Possible things that would be worth spending talents on is. Increased range between the targets, that chain heal can jump between... I am being a sad shaman to see when my chain heal doesn't jump at all because people hurried to run out of its range...

Don't know if this is the kind of responds Salthem was wanting when creating this thread.

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Q u o t e:

Focused mind
Erhm 15%?... Anyway... limited use pve wise...

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In 2.2 It will 30%

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Q u o t e:
Resto
And resto only!.

One of the things i find odd about talent tree is 'the lack' of a proper raid build as Healing shaman.

http://www.wow-europe.com/en/info/basics/talents/shaman/talents.html?0000000000000000000050000000000000000000055230051050310510321
these are the talents i consider important as key talents, but it leaves 14 points for? ... random stuff.

Healing Grace
Threat isn't really a issue in raid, can be argued that it is in 5man group, but well, i havn't had problems with aggro in a 5man heroic when solo healing. Threat only seems to be a problem when stuff is running around loose without any to tank it, or with a poor tank.

Totemic Focus
So normal totem setups
Strength (300mana), Random Fire (300mana), Mana spring (120mana), Windfury (325mana),
Total 1045mana. Every 2minute. Thats 43mp5. Talented 5/5 its 32mp5. 11mana per 5.

Strength (300mana), Flame Tongue (325mana), Mana Spring (120mana), Grace of Air (310mana)
Total 1055mana. Every 2minute. Thats 44mp5. Talented 5/5 its 33mp5. 11mana per 5.

I honestly don't think that 5 talent points is this little mana savings worth. It would be worth 2 points, but not 5, however what else to put them into?
What else to put them into?

Nature's Guidance
Nothing to do with healing at all.

Tidal Mastery
Well, yes this talent will increase your healing. however, i cannot rely on my healing to crit, and ideal, if my heal crits, it will over heal. Of course its 'nice' when it crits and its needed. But 5 talent points for 'nice' ? .. meh seems more like candy to get elementals to come into resto tree.

Focused mind
Erhm 15%?... Anyway... limited use pve wise...

Nature's Guardian
This talent is so imba in pvp, and low end raiding (Where mobs doesn't 1-2 hit you)
However, very limited use while raiding.

So this leaves us with 14 talents to spend on?, random stuff?... Sure we could go for lots of stuff. But they wont really help us while raiding.

---

Possible things that would be worth spending talents on is. Increased range between the targets, that chain heal can jump between... I am being a sad shaman to see when my chain heal doesn't jump at all because people hurried to run out of its range...

Don't know if this is the kind of responds Salthem was wanting when creating this thread.

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some of what you put i agree alot however you may wish to rethink..

Healing grace, very useable keeps agro well down , if your not getting reasonably high try healing more.

Focused mind, plenty of silences within game where this comes in handy

Tidal mastery, crits are more then welcome more % the better if you dont want to overheal from critting try down ranking.

Naures Gaurdian is the biggest waste of space within the game

Totemic focus isn't great but for long fights it does sort of have its use esp when having to replace totems quite often.

This needs a very big and well thought out post, the like of which has been seen a few times before on this forum.

This is 1 enhancement shaman requesting a forum-old-schooler to clearly and concisely outline our problems - everything.

We have asked for attention and we are getting it, if you ever wanted to make a wall of text post, now is the time.

This post is here because i can't do it, and others are far better at it than me. I'm going to go and look for the good old threads with full explanations and post the links here.

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Q u o t e:
This needs a very big and well thought out post, the like of which has been seen a few times before on this forum.

This is 1 enhancement shaman requesting a forum-old-schooler to clearly and concisely outline our problems - everything.

We have asked for attention and we are getting it, if you ever wanted to make a wall of text post, now is the time.

This post is here because i can't do it, and others are far better at it than me. I'm going to go and look for the good old threads with full explanations and post the links here.

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Time to visit Snorkle xD

Too bad he's stopped replying on these boards because of all the senseless whining here =(


Anyways, on topic, great that you're showing some interest in us =D
It's welcoming in my opinion!

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Q u o t e:
Too bad he's stopped replying on these boards because of all the senseless whining here =(

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._.

In lovin' memory, mon

Couldn't agree more with Telamonn.

I suggest that we try and keep the discussion and suggestions as relevant and realistic as possible, and yes, a clear and concise overall explanation from an experience player would be very helpful indeed. Of course, this is needed for each talent spec and focus of PvE / PvP and not just Enhancement.

And thanks to Blizzard for giving us the opportunity to have our say.
I'll keep quiet from now on unless I have something highly relevant to contribute :]

3/44/14
enhancement for pve

Shiled spec is useless

IMPROVE LIGHTING SHILED
useless nowaday small buff to only one shiled

change to buff all shiled and als give them some extra pwer(es: increase your lighting,water and earth shield by X.Y,X also grants your lighting shield to increase haste by X grants your water shild X chance to dispel poison and your earth shiled to increase dodge by X

and many others talents need to change

I'm an Enhancement shaman focused in PvE so I'd like to list my problems/suggestions about this tree.

Ancestral Knowledge
It is a worthless talent for an enhancement shaman who has shamanistic rage. I'd put this talent to restoration or elemental trees and have something that boosts my damage directly, like Divine Strength for paladins (increases your strength by 2% per point, but in our case attack power instead of strength would be even better)

Shield Specialization and Toughness
Those who focus on PvP with enhancement build won't use these talent either. A shaman won't be good enough for tanking, there's no point using these talents and nobody will put points to these talents for "just in case" situations. I think these talents are meant for improving our survivability, but we never use shields and 10% more armor is so little that it doesn't really count that much. Anticipation is a good way I think. Something like better chances to resist area of effect damage spells and skills would be really useful instead of these.

Guardian Totems
Stoneskin Totem and Windwall Totem are still rarely used. Reducing the cooldown of Grounding Totem does not worth 2 points for me. I'd like to see it's also increasing the effect of Tranquil Air totem by 5% per point.

Improved Ghost Wolf
It would be a great talent for escape if it made the spell insant. However it would be imbalanced so I'd suggest something like Nature's Swiftness for Ghost Wolf only. An instant Ghost Wolf form in every 2/1 minutes for one/two point(s).

Mental Quickness
It's almost the same as Ancestral Knowledge. I don't really want to put points to this talent because I have Shamanistic Rage and I don't have problems with mana. What I'd like to see here is the idea of totems without global cooldowns in some form.

Elemental Weapons
It's not really a problem with the talent, it's that we use windfury weapon only and beause of this I feel like I wasted points on the talent. I can't use it's full potential because the other weapon buffs does not scale with the gear enhancement shamans use. But this is not a talent problem.

Hey

In my oppinion the enhancement talents are just plain boring. I know, i know Windfury *woopdidu*. But that's all it's based on. In all seriousness, being enhancement isnt that easy really - but I think elemental is much more of a challenge.
Enhancement is so luck based. It needs something else, something that makes it a challenge to be enhancementspecced shaman. Not just a lvlingspecc as it is today!

And a 30% to avoid spellcast interruption on lightning shield wouldn't suck tbh.

I hope the Shaman class once more can be as great as it was before TBC.

Imo i would love to see some form of improved Ghost Wolf.
Maby make it instant from talents and that it removes movment imperaling effects? I dont know. I would just love to see it beeing used again :)

ok again from an enhancement shaman POV here, for both PvE and PvP - and i'll try and take into account the newly announced talents as well here.

ok some of this will be similar repitition to an above post, but reiteration from a different view point cant really hurt i guess

Tier 1 Talents: tbh both suck, the only reason either is taken is to advance further into the tree . . .

Ancestral Knowledge: maximum mana by 5% . . . why? just why? we dont really need the extra mana, and tbh its not even that much, i think for me it equates to about a single shock's worth of mana pretty much . . .

- i'd suggest either changing the talent to something completely different, or changing it to increase strength or perhaps even hit . . .

Shield Specialisation: mite be nice if we were capable of tanking possibly combined with some more "tanking" style mail gear while using the improved Shamanistic rage it mite be worth it for short 30s tanking bursts . . . but as i doubt we're longer intended to tank anything its pretty much wasted, possibly reduce the number of talent points to 2 for it and add a nice lil 3 pointer in the first tier for more options . . . .

Tier 2 Talents: this is where it starts getting interesting . . .

Guardian Totems: stoneclaw and windwall pretty much suck and are rarely used at lvl 70 (or windwall at any lvl really) tho for pvp this is very useful for the reduced CD on grounding totem but thats about it, i'm happy paying the 2 talent points for that, but i imagine some people arent . . .

Thundering Strikes: definately no complaints here - core enhancement talent really - tho i once heard rumour that it didnt affect SS or WF . . . not sure about that tho.

Improved Ghost Wolf - only really useful for lvling till u get ur first mount at 40, and for Flag carrying in WSG really . . . as many people said it would be much better if the improvement made it instant cast, that alone would make it worth it really, adding root and snare removals like druids would be nice, but possibly over powering in some respects, i wouldnt complain if it did, but wouldnt say its needed . . .

Improved Lightning shield: very much an outdated pre TBC talent now, lightning shield is generally used in the opening then water shield is often applied next i find, i'd suggest making it improve all elemental shields by 15% (damage of lightning and mana regen of water) except perhaps earth shield, as that mite be very over powered . . . (but mite be a use for those 14 spare points the above poster meantioned)

Tier 3 Talents: all good really, and non need comments on . . . .

Tier 4 Talents:

Flurry - no problems, all ok here.

Toughness - loose it, and loose it now, it has 0% use now days especially for 5 talent points it costs - unless u intend to implement tanking gear for us and more tanking abilities please replace this talent with another, preferably one that increases stamina or raw Hp instead as that would be far more useful . . . 10% stamina increase would be very welcome as we have very low base Hp compared to other classes . . .

Tier 5 Talents: generally ok . . .

Improved Weapon Totems: just handy for providing better WF for those MS warriors about . . . guess theres no real complaints there

Spirit weapons: i'd make parry trainable at 30 or 40 and increase the threat modifyer - and ensure it includes SS and WF damage (as again its rumoured not to) also reduced threat from shocks would also be very nice for PvE

Elemental weapons: a clear choice to improve WF, but the other weapon imbue improvements are wasted, as we dont use them - either change this talent to scale them using melee stats, or just scale them with melee stats normally and keep this the same - atm its just a lot of writing that only really needs to say "Increases the attack power bonus of your windfury weapon effect by 40%"

Tier 6 Talents: with the changes to mental quickness both of these talents are very sexy now and little needs to be said here.

Tier 7 Talents: again all good and amazing for all enhancement shamans - tho i'd like to up the improved DWing talent to say 9% as our reliance on +hit gear can make getting our other stats that we need a chore . . . also possibly add in an "improved Stormstrike" talent for a few points, prehaps adding a AP modifier to it, or reducing CD or something . . .

Tier 8 and 9 talents - just pure sexy really unleashed rage is the reason we're now in raids so lets not nerf that at all, wouldnt say it needs a buff either really, and the changes to shamanistic rage will surely make it a better talent to take over NS for PvP, and the new damage modifyer will undoubtedly have benifits for some PvE situations as well . . .

i'm not sure what i'd suggest for new talents going towards the 51 point talent for WotLK - tho unless u plan to give us one as a new ability while lvling i'd love to see the 51 point talent a new melee move - as we are speccing to be a melee class and only have 1 melee move . . . .

another possibility is adding weapon specialisations into the enhancement tree - 5% stun proc on maces would go down very well thank you . . . .

if i come up with more i'll share it later, but for now thats me done

hope this helps

Above poster didnt post on a shaman! :O

About lightning overload, I can't see why everyone is bashing it when it is the exact same as concussion way up at the tip top, concussion increases damage by 5%, lightning overload increases damage by 5%. it just means that if you spec deeper into elemental you will recieve greater spell buffs and lightning overload is definitely better than concussion due to the actual effect of it being instananeous and not over time, but over time it will be the exact same as concussion anyway.

To those saying it should have a 15% proc chance, you are asking for +10% overall damage over time, and by over time i mean for example cast 100 spells and gain 5 extra spells with lightning overload , with concussion it's cast 100 spells that will do the same total damage as 105 spells.. SAME THING

I'm an Enhancement shaman, so I'll only comment on the talents concerning my area of expertise. On a whole, the Enhancement tree has some very good talents, but there is some dead wood in it. Some of the dead wood is downright rotten. My main issue with it is lack of choice due to said dead wood. I feel pigeonholed when chosing talents in few places due to the other talents in a few places. The talents I find most lacking are outlined above, with suggested changes.

Tier 1

Ancestral Knowledge
5% mana increase for 5 talent points is weak, very weak. It is also not very helpful to the Enhancement role, since with the mana regen provided by Shamanistic Rage have a very large mana pool is rendered redundant. I would replace it with a increase in Attack Power, possibly 2/4/6/8/10%. One would argue that Str would be more suitable, and I would agree under ideal circumstances. However, the current itemization at 70 doesn't really support it. 19 out of 20 pieces will have +attack power, not +Strength.

Sheid Specialization
Remember me talking about rotten dead wood? This is it. This talent is a bad joke. There is no shaman I have ever met, or even heard of, that use a shield because it allows them to block. They use it for the solid armor, and the stats, no more. This talent is a relic, a leftover from days long past and should really be replaced by something not utterly useless. I would suggest a talent that increases chances to resist Fear/Stun.

Tier 2

Guardian Totems
Windwall and Stoneskin Totems are lackluster, and almost never used. Reduced Cooldown on Grounding makes it move above useless. Would like to see it improve Tranquil Air totem to give it added appeal and utility

Improved Ghost Wolf
Not useless, but not far from it either. Two seconds may mean the difference between escaping or not, but the great majority of times this talent does nothing. Ideal change would be to have the talent improve chances of breaking and resisting snares while in Ghost Wolf form, as well as reduce the cast time. 30/60% chance to break roots/snares when cast and 10/15% chance to resist snare/root while in Ghost Wolf.

Improved Lightning Shield
In it's current state, not the strongest talent around by a ways. 15% increse for 3 points is decent, but would like to see a change to include bonuses to other Elemental Shields.

Tier 3

Two-Handed Axe/Mace
A talent for learning to wield weapons. Clunky, best word for it really. Weapons should be trailable skills, not talents. Unsure what to replace it with. Perhaps something relating to weapons. Increased weapon skills talent. Two pointer, 2/3 weapon skill gained?

Tier 4

Toughness
10% Armor for 5 talent points is not really worthwhile, nor all that useful. This talent feels like another of the old relics left from the dawn of time. Replacemt with a talent allowing Shamans to wear plate, with a hefty reduction in armor to bring it in more in line with regular mail? Would solve the lack of really proper itemization for some slots, since DPS warrior plate has a stat point distribution very much in line with what most Enhancement Shamans look for. I often see plate drop and think "I wish there were mail items like that". After all, if Thrall has a talent to wear plate, why can't we?

Tier 5

Spirit Weapons
Since tests seem to indicate that the Threat Reduction component of Spirit Weapons does not include Stormstrike or Windfury I would like to either see them included, or the percentage reduction increased. Threat is a severly limiting factor for Enhancement, and we have no way of dumping or wiping threat short of the so called Shaman Vanish, I.E dying and Reincarnating, costly in both Gold and lost buffs.

Tier 6

Mental Quickness
In it's current incarnation it is weak. 6% is not exactly huge change. I have seen the screenshots of Blizzcon and the change to make it give a amount of spell power equal to 10/20/30% of Attack Power makes it a very viable talent. Not only because of what it would do to keeping our damage output competetive.

The biggest impact would be a lessened reliance on slow offhand weapons with Windfury. Flame Tongue as a weapon buff is no where near Windfury in terms of power levels. Flametongue does however scale with spell damage. And when you reach high amounts of + damage Flametongue closes the gap if used with a fast weapon. So it would serve to lessen the pigeonholing in weapon choices to some extent. It does however take over 800 +damage to achive such a scaling. Another secondary benefit would be the boost to healing, making healing yourself in PvP and PvE more viable.

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Q u o t e:
Guardian Totems
Stoneskin Totem and Windwall Totem are still rarely used. Reducing the cooldown of Grounding Totem does not worth 2 points for me. I'd like to see it's also increasing the effect of Tranquil Air totem by 5% per point.
.

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speak for yourself, i think its gr8 having imp stoneskin and windwall totems :P

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Q u o t e:
- Build:
41/0/20 (Focus: PvE)

- What, in your opinion, is the key talent to your build and why?

Lightning Mastery. It allows our nukes (combined with the other talents affecting Lightning) to scale to a level where we can potentially gain an equal footing to other classes.

- What talent, in your build, would you replace if you could and with what?

Lightning Overload. I would change it to allow for a party affecting buff of some kind on top of working as it currently does. Possibly something which buffs the spell damage stat of all members of the party by 1%/2%/3%/4%/5% for X seconds whenever one of your spells crit. This would put it closer to the effect Unleashed Rage gives Enhance Shaman parties, and give Elemental Shaman a reason to DPS.

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Q u o t e:
Second post, now with the PvP build.

- Build:
40/0/21 (Focus: PvP)

- What, in your opinion, is the key talent to your build and why?

Nature's Swiftness and/or Elemental Mastery. Nature's Swiftness allows for some of the greatest versatility in the game, and Elemental Mastery is a very handy "Damage on Demand" ability.

- What talent, in your build, would you replace if you could and with what?

Elemental Shields. I would replace it with a tool to allow the Elemental Shaman to gain range on his opponent. Possibly with this:

Earthgrab Totem: Turns the Earthbind Totem into Earthgrab Totem. It has 33%/66%/100% chance to root targets affected by the Earthbind pulse for X seconds.

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These are my two posts. Both of course concerning Elemental. Comments would be greatly appreciated, and I tried to keep it simple and in character with the Shaman class (crit activated abilities and a totem based "CC" if that is what you would call it, for a heavy investment in the Elemental Tree).