World of Warcraft (en) Forums -> 02/08 Raid and Dungeon Encounter Update

Salthem

Blizzard Poster

0. 02/08 Raid and Dungeon Encounter Update 02/08/2007 04:53:45 PDT

Daelo, has posted on upcoming changes to raid encounters in patch 2.2:
http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=711993555&sid=1

I wanted to update everyone and highlight some upcoming changes in the 2.2 patch for some of our raid encounters. Many of these changes are not on test yet, and this isn't every single improvement that's being made.

Archimonde
- Archimonde's Fear had a recast time that could be very inconsistent, which would cause problems for tanks who were waiting to react to the fear being cast. Along with making the fear more consistent, the minimum time between fears has been increased and the casting time will be 1.5 seconds.
- Grip of the Legion will not be able to target players who were just Air Burst, and it now has a non-infinite range.
- Red Soul Charges silence for 4 seconds instead of 6 seconds.
- The bug where Priests with Spirit of Redemption creating two Soul Charges on death is fixed.

Mother Shahraz
- The players targeted by Saber Lash now gain the immunity to Sinister Beam and Fatal Attraction, regardless of whether or not Saber Lash actually landed.
- Shahraz will now pick a new beam to cast after every 3rd cast, instead of every 5th.
- The first two seconds of Fatal Attraction now deals reduced damage.
- Prismatic Shield has been completely reworked. The shield is no longer adaptive. She periodically picks a random school to be resistant to, and the "opposite" school gets a bonus. Casters rejoice.
- In a later patch, we're blocking off some of the nastier places to get placed by Fatal Attraction, and the "Couches of Death" we'll be fixed. In the meantime, you should be able to mitigate a problematic Fatal Attraction teleport by tanking Mother Shahraz away from these locations.
- Also in a later patch, we'll be able to disable the "decreased melee swing time" effect caused by Mother Shahraz parrying a melee attack. The parry mechanic is exacerbating the already rather intense burst damage that Mother Shahraz can inflict.

Reliquary of the Lost
- Essence of Desire's Spirit Shock and Rune Shield will no longer be able to be cast nearly simultaneously. We added in a very small, but very significant delay in between the two.

Prince Kael'thas
- Completing Phase 1 of the encounter will now take considerably less time.

Heroic Dungeon Changes
The list is too extensive to go into here, but we have been monitoring the Heroic Dungeon Feedback thread and we've made some further changes to quite a few trash creatures and bosses. A more complete list of changes will be available as 2.2 testing on the PTR progresses.

Tempest Keep and Serpentshrine Trash ability tuning
We're making some further adjustments to several of the more punishing abilities on trash creatures in these two zones.

I'll see you all at the Raid & Dungeon panel at Blizzcon!

Daelo
Lead Encounter Designer

"I was elected to lead, not to read."

Upirspike

< Passion >

Ahn'Qiraj

1. Re: 02/08 Raid and Dungeon Encounter Update 02/08/2007 05:22:16 PDT

kael nerf:o( stop the nerfs pls....

[ Post edited by Upirspike ]

Sheria

< Silence >

Silvermoon

2. Re: 02/08 Raid and Dungeon Encounter Update 02/08/2007 05:23:36 PDT

I will admit im getting tired of constant nerfs...

Beauty is in the Eye of the Beholder

Lennaha

Quel'Thalas

3. Re: 02/08 Raid and Dungeon Encounter Update 02/08/2007 05:36:53 PDT

Q u o t e:
I will admit im getting tired of constant nerfs...

And how would you feel if Blizz didnt change Vashj at all, and let her stay the same as in pre 2.1? so only Nihilum, Method and maybe a few other guilds would have ben in BT now, and the rest, including your guild still stuck on Vashj. She was indeed killable, but very very very hard. But ppl like you only complain about nerfs regarding bosses you have killed. Like common, I even saw ppl that had ben able to kill the imba Gruul pre nerf long ago, screaming out "dont nerf him, he is fine as he is"

Sheria

< Silence >

Silvermoon

4. Re: 02/08 Raid and Dungeon Encounter Update 02/08/2007 05:44:39 PDT

Q u o t e:

And how would you feel if Blizz didnt change Vashj at all, and let her stay the same as in pre 2.1? so only Nihilum, Method and maybe a few other guilds would have ben in BT now, and the rest, including your guild still stuck on Vashj. She was indeed killable, but very very very hard. But ppl like you only complain about nerfs regarding bosses you have killed. Like common, I even saw ppl that had ben able to kill the imba Gruul pre nerf long ago, screaming out "dont nerf him, he is fine as he is"

I think its safe to say Vashj was broken, without it bugging it was only one guild that killed her and only through extensive potting. New kills on all other bosses mentioned are coming in every day.

But i think the main problem is many changes are bieng made based on public feedback, and because of that ,nerfing may never stop as there is always going to be someone who still finds something too difficult

[ Post edited by Sheria ]

Beauty is in the Eye of the Beholder

Upirspike

< Passion >

Ahn'Qiraj

5. Re: 02/08 Raid and Dungeon Encounter Update 02/08/2007 05:47:44 PDT

Q u o t e:

And how would you feel if Blizz didnt change Vashj at all, and let her stay the same as in pre 2.1? so only Nihilum, Method and maybe a few other guilds would have ben in BT now, and the rest, including your guild still stuck on Vashj. She was indeed killable, but very very very hard. But ppl like you only complain about nerfs regarding bosses you have killed. Like common, I even saw ppl that had ben able to kill the imba Gruul pre nerf long ago, screaming out "dont nerf him, he is fine as he is"

fixing bugs is fine ..nerfing is not..imho..now seems like difficulty is good enough...maaany guilds R far in progres...in hyjal, BT so...seems like difficulty is ok..so pls no nerfs

Kofoed

< Unknown Entity >

Sunstrider

6. Re: 02/08 Raid and Dungeon Encounter Update 02/08/2007 07:44:41 PDT

Q u o t e:
kael nerf:o( stop the nerfs pls....

,

So you think this is a nerf? or just making phase 1 faster as it's so easy anyway and just taking time.

Q u o t e:
But i think the main problem is many changes are bieng made based on public feedback, and because of that ,nerfing may never stop as there is always going to be someone who still finds something too difficult

Again what should they else make it from? beside Mother Shahraz is retarded atm (afaik anyway), heard a bit the same about Archimonde, making phase 1 at Kael'thas faster is not really even an nerf.

[ Post edited by Kofoed ]

Nickolina

< Dark Ritual >

7. Re: 02/08 Raid and Dungeon Encounter Update 02/08/2007 08:48:31 PDT

Excellent news

Nickolina 70 Mage - Stormreaver
Nikolina 70 Rogue - Stormreaver

Enchanting :: Tailoring :: Alchemy

Neeko

< Inner Sanctum >

Silvermoon

8. Re: 02/08 Raid and Dungeon Encounter Update 02/08/2007 13:55:40 PDT

Mother Shahraz will no longer be harder then Illidan ?
whers the logic in that ?

Lennaha

Quel'Thalas

9. Re: 02/08 Raid and Dungeon Encounter Update 02/08/2007 14:29:09 PDT

Q u o t e:
Mother Shahraz will no longer be harder then Illidan ?
whers the logic in that ?

Yep, and Shahraz and Archimonde ( 2 of the last t6 bosses) will also no longer be harder than Kael Thas ( a t5 attunement boss ) Nice logic indeed, Blizzard logic at its finest.

And Blizzzard? at least remove the trash respawns in front of Kael, its way more needed than nerfing / removing randomness from Archimonde and Shahraz, since these bosses are some of the end t6 bosses and ment to be very hard. And Reliquary nerfed as well?

After this patch, Kael Thas might be the hardest boss in entire game only toped by maybe Illidan.

[ Post edited by Lennaha ]

Hastings

< Muerte Súbita >

Tyrande

10. Re: 02/08 Raid and Dungeon Encounter Update 03/08/2007 04:29:24 PDT

Q u o t e:

Yep, and Shahraz and Archimonde ( 2 of the last t6 bosses) will also no longer be harder than Kael Thas ( a t5 attunement boss ) Nice logic indeed, Blizzard logic at its finest.

And Blizzzard? at least remove the trash respawns in front of Kael, its way more needed than nerfing / removing randomness from Archimonde and Shahraz, since these bosses are some of the end t6 bosses and ment to be very hard. And Reliquary nerfed as well?

After this patch, Kael Thas might be the hardest boss in entire game only toped by maybe Illidan.

Trolls are so fun.

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Engelbrekt

< The Four Ponymen >

Mazrigos

11. Re: 02/08 Raid and Dungeon Encounter Update 03/08/2007 05:00:32 PDT

Q u o t e:
- Archimonde's Fear had a recast time that could be very inconsistent, which would cause problems for tanks who were waiting to react to the fear being cast. Along with making the fear more consistent, the minimum time between fears has been increased and the casting time will be 1.5 seconds.

Not so nice to see that blizzards definition of "Tank" equals Warrior.

Perhaps time to review encounters that involve excessive use of fear so that the other classes that should be included in this "Tank" definition wouldnt have to rely on laggy tremor totems etc (causing other ppl to get hit-killed/boss to change position during the second(s) it takes for tremor totem to kick in)?

Alternatively give the other tanks.. ehm..sorry.. the other Classes-Who-Can-Tank-But-Are-Not-Considered-Tanks abilities to also counter fear?

Hastings

< Muerte Súbita >

Tyrande

12. Re: 02/08 Raid and Dungeon Encounter Update 03/08/2007 05:12:31 PDT

I really agree with you Engel, I have a feral druid as alter (level 70 obviously), and I was tanking in one of our unofficial KZ runs, and hell, the only reason because I was able to tank Nightbane with no problems at all, was due to Fear Ward.

I can't see how a feral druid in the horde side would do this, the Tremor totem thingy doesn't seem that reliable to me.

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Kazroth

Earthen Ring

13. Re: 02/08 Raid and Dungeon Encounter Update 03/08/2007 06:52:02 PDT

Nightbanes fear was changed so he would follow the tank.

There are problems if they introduce this mechanic to all fear fights.

1. Feared tank could get 2 shot by a double crushing.
2. tank could get feared into group and cleave could kill alot of people.

Just some feedback,

Pre-TBC blizzard did seem to imply that there would be no fear based encounters, however contary to this you have archimonde and nightbane. Unless archmondes fear behaves like nightbanes and your tank is extremely lucky your tank dies unless they are a warrior.

Seems to me that blizzards definition of tank is infact warrior which is a real let down to protection paladins and feral druids., more so protection paladins since their actual use is limited unless they are being hit.

Hastings

< Muerte Súbita >

Tyrande

14. Re: 02/08 Raid and Dungeon Encounter Update 03/08/2007 07:19:47 PDT

Q u o t e:
Nightbanes fear was changed so he would follow the tank.

There are problems if they introduce this mechanic to all fear fights.

1. Feared tank could get 2 shot by a double crushing.
2. tank could get feared into group and cleave could kill alot of people.

Just some feedback,

Pre-TBC blizzard did seem to imply that there would be no fear based encounters, however contary to this you have archimonde and nightbane. Unless archmondes fear behaves like nightbanes and your tank is extremely lucky your tank dies unless they are a warrior.

Seems to me that blizzards definition of tank is infact warrior which is a real let down to protection paladins and feral druids., more so protection paladins since their actual use is limited unless they are being hit.

Not really, crushings are overrated (seriously), my druid is sitting at 17k fully buffed, and not even Doomwalker or Alar, chain crushing twice would kill him (Alar crushes my druid for around 6k, without being that geared, really, all blues except a pair of gloves from attumen (nothing special), and the necklace from the chess event), even after two crushes in a row (5 secs, as every boss atacks each 2.5s and special abilities, even if physycal, can't crush), I would have 5k left, and the next swing of the boss, would be 4k, the chance for a 3rd crushing in a row is unlikely, so...

[ Post edited by Hastings ]

http://www.wowspain.net, Fansite en español dedicado a World of Warcraft

Sylisha

Ghostlands

15. Re: 02/08 Raid and Dungeon Encounter Update 05/08/2007 13:47:46 PDT

Think guys, phase 1 takes shorter but phase 3 wont.
If the adds would have been nerfed in hp then phase 3 would have been shorter, my guess it doesnt take like 50seconds before thaladred even starts to move.. cuz thats just annoying.

Saroz

< Random >

16. Re: 02/08 Raid and Dungeon Encounter Update 05/08/2007 16:57:06 PDT

Please throw the nerf stick at Vashj aswell, seriously - Phase 2 is far too little forgiving and the entire fight requires perfect execution down to the millimeter or stacking your raid with range dps (oh wow, never seen that problem before *bangs head on table*) and even then you can have Vashj throw Forked lightning at the same area/targets 5 times in a row.

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Ailawiu

< PathFinders >

17. Re: 02/08 Raid and Dungeon Encounter Update 05/08/2007 18:18:18 PDT

Q u o t e:
Phase 2 is far too little forgiving and the entire fight requires perfect execution down to the millimeter or stacking your raid with range dps (oh wow, never seen that problem before *bangs head on table*)

Well, it's just the stacking that sucks - even though we're just working on her, everything else seems fine. But it's ridicilous how big difference ranged makes there, both on Tainteds and Striders(like, duh, way to make meelee immune mob, except for Deathwish warriors that will likely get 1 shoted anyway). The idea of mob that needs to be kited is all good and well, but something that despawns before meelee even reaches it(in case of bad spawn) is not.

Whatever

Saroz

< Random >

18. Re: 02/08 Raid and Dungeon Encounter Update 06/08/2007 12:25:13 PDT

Also, Entangle combined with the Toxic Spores is just pure genius, really showing some hate to melee... Gotta love that, really makes me want to bring rogues.

[ Post edited by Saroz ]

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Pat

< Rush Hour >

Trollbane

19. Re: 02/08 Raid and Dungeon Encounter Update 07/08/2007 00:28:26 PDT

Q u o t e:
I really agree with you Engel, I have a feral druid as alter (level 70 obviously), and I was tanking in one of our unofficial KZ runs, and hell, the only reason because I was able to tank Nightbane with no problems at all, was due to Fear Ward.

I can't see how a feral druid in the horde side would do this, the Tremor totem thingy doesn't seem that reliable to me.

Its no problem for a Horde druid to tank Nightbane.

I´ve done it with PvP-trinket as only antifear, if dps is high enough he will only fear once each "groundphase".
Seen it done with a shammy stomping tremor at fear due to the druid having the PvP-trinket with longer cooldown., not the safest method but it worked.

Raid & Dungeons