It takes 15.77 Expertise rating to gain 4 expertise at level 70 which will lower your target's chance to dodge or parry your attacks by 1%. Basically 3.9425 rating per point.
Boss mobs have a ~6.5% dodge chance versus your attacks. 6.5/0.24 = 26 Expertise needed to negate this completely, which equals 104 expertise rating. Also keep in mind, since ranged attacks can not be dodged by default, expertise only affects melee attacks.

Human rogues get a racial +5 expertise (1.25%) when using swords or maces. 19.7125 Expertise rating.
Combat rogues can get +10 expertise (2.5%). 39,425 Expertise rating.

Some items that give expertise :
* Shard of Contempt : 44 (11,16 @ L70)
* Slayer's Boots : 24 (6.09 @ L70)
* Belt of One-Hundred Deaths : 25 (6.34 @ L70)
* Shattered Sun Pendant of Resolve : 18 (4.57 @ L70)
* Brooch of Deftness : 21 (5.33 @ L70)
* Shoulderpads of the Stranger : 10 (2.54 @ L70)
* Gloves of the Searing Grip : 18 (4.57 @ L70)
* Grips of Deftness : 15 (3.8 @ L70)
* Shapeshifter's Signet : 20 (5.07 @ L70)
* Fang of Vashj : 21 (5.33 @ L70)
* Dragonscale-Encrusted Longblade : 25 (6.34 @ L70)

So, in patch 2.4 if you have the weapon expertise talent (39.425), Slayer's Boots (24), and Shard of Contempt (44) then you'd be on 107.425 Expertise rating. ~3 expertise rating over the cap.

Read the rest of the article here : http://rrvs.blogspot.com/2008/02/hit-and-expertise.html

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Q u o t e:
It takes 15.77 Expertise rating to gain 4 expertise at level 70 ower your target's chance to dodge or parry your attacks by 1%. Basically 3.9425 rating per point.
Boss mobs have a ~6.5% dodge chance versus your attacks. 6.5/0.24 = 26 Expertise needed to negate this completely, which equals 104 expertise rating. Also keep in mind, since ranged attacks can not be dodged by default, expertise only affects melee attacks.

Human rogues get a racial +5 expertise (1.25%) when using swords or maces. 19.7125 Expertise rating.
Combat rogues can get +10 expertise (2.5%). 39,425 Expertise rating.

Some items that give expertise :
* Shard of Contempt : 44 (11,16 @ L70)
* Slayer's Boots : 24 (6.09 @ L70)
* Belt of One-Hundred Deaths : 25 (6.34 @ L70)
* Shattered Sun Pendant of Resolve : 18 (4.57 @ L70)
* Brooch of Deftness : 21 (5.33 @ L70)
* Shoulderpads of the Stranger : 10 (2.54 @ L70)
* Gloves of the Searing Grip : 18 (4.57 @ L70)
* Grips of Deftness : 15 (3.8 @ L70)
* Shapeshifter's Signet : 20 (5.07 @ L70)
* Fang of Vashj : 21 (5.33 @ L70)

So, in patch 2.4 if you have the weapon expertise talent (39.425), Slayer's Boots (24), and Shard of Contempt (44) then you'd be on 107.425 Expertise rating. ~3 expertise rating over the cap.

Read the rest of the article here : http://rrvs.blogspot.com/2008/02/hit-and-expertise.html

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You are my hero <3

(reported for sticky)

Thanks mate, great job. Hadn't bothered to look into exp ratings yet since I'm not 70. But now I don't have to :D

Fixed a bit of spelling, and added dragonscale sword.
Seems pretty easy to reach the expertise cap.

So I'd better get the T5 gloves to replace my Deftness ones before I get the Vashj belt, or else I'd be wasting expertise rating! Nice guide, thanks.

I guess this means that for hemo trispec builds, if you happen to get a lot of expertise gear you can drop a point of wep expertise in favour of filling up sword spec or dirty deeds. Combat builds don't really have anywhere good to move WX points into, unless you call vile poisons good...

very nice

I'm curious, when and where were was it worked out boss's dodge was ~6.5%?

I'm not saying it's wrong, I'm just genuinely interested, I missed this o.O

sticky!!
Great guide tbh, simple and clear.

No offence, but I hate the guides with pages and pages over a easy subject .,.

Please add to stickies.

The stickies are rather crowded, but you can always just bookmark it ;)

Three things
1) I don't think it's that a good idea to run around all the time with expertise capped, 20 expertise i.e. 5% change against lvl 70's not to be dodged and parried is more than fine.
2) Bosses are..bosses, they don't all have (an assumed) 6.5% change to dodge/parry your attacks. Mother Shahraz comes to mind, seems to be able to dodge around 7% or so.
3) Expertise rating is truncated, meaning 3.45 expertise calculated from rating is 3 expertise.

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Q u o t e:
Three things
1) I don't think it's that a good idea to run around all the time with expertise capped, 20 expertise i.e. 5% change against lvl 70's not to be dodged and parried is more than fine.
2) Bosses are..bosses, they don't all have (an assumed) 6.5% change to dodge/parry your attacks. Mother Shahraz comes to mind, seems to be able to dodge around 7% or so.
3) Expertise rating is truncated, meaning 3.45 expertise calculated from rating is 3 expertise.

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1)What you can do is switch some gear so you don't have more than 20 Expertise on trash and maximize your Expertise on bosses. The more the better, if you can reach it. There is no "fine".
2)Never heard of it, we could blame RNG for seeing this.
3)Indeed but if you are careful you won't lose any expertise.

To the OP, you're saying
"In effect, as long as you are standing behind your target, point for point you can stack expertise or hit rating to the same effect."

Perhaps the wording is confusing, but if you mean that Hit is as effective as Expertise(Until you cap hit) it's not. Expertise is slightly better. But then again I just woke up so maybe my reading comprehension fails.

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Q u o t e:

Perhaps the wording is confusing, but if you mean that Hit is as effective as Expertise(Until you cap hit) it's not. Expertise is slightly better. But then again I just woke up so maybe my reading comprehension fails.

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hit and expertise give the same hit chance basically.

Missing an attack doesn't return energy iirc.
if your attack is dodged i think you get 50% back. so hit is better than expertise under that assumption.

This may have changed recently however, and suprise attacks kills the effect on finishing moves (unless you're not combat spec)

1% is still 1% however, hit and expertise are the same in that effect.
Expertise is more versatile though, as it allows you more damage when on the front side of a mob as well.

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Q u o t e:


hit and expertise give the same hit chance basically.

Missing an attack doesn't return energy iirc.
if your attack is dodged i think you get 50% back. so hit is better than expertise under that assumption.

This may have changed recently however, and suprise attacks kills the effect on finishing moves (unless you're not combat spec)

1% is still 1% however, hit and expertise are the same in that effect.
Expertise is more versatile though, as it allows you more damage when on the front side of a mob as well.

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You're forgetting special attacks. Surprise Attacks will make your finishers undodgeable although your Sinister Strike/Backstab can still get dodged. You don't need to cap Hit to make your special attacks not miss. You only need 9% additional hit chance while the hit cap is 28% against bosses.

So after having this 9% hit, any +Hit you take will only increase your white damage, BUT any 1% of expertise will increase your TOTAL damage since it also increases your yellow damage.

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Q u o t e:

You're forgetting special attacks. Surprise Attacks will make your finishers undodgeable although your Sinister Strike/Backstab can still get dodged. You don't need to cap Hit to make your special attacks not miss. You only need 9% additional hit chance while the hit cap is 28% against bosses.

So after having this 9% hit, any +Hit you take will only increase your white damage, BUT any 1% of expertise will increase your TOTAL damage since it also increases your yellow damage.

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Quite correct, i'll modify that later.

White attacks can be dodged as well, though those are affected in the same way as hit.
The dodge vs energy loss still holds true as well though, trispec is most susceptible to this.
About 20% of your damage should be from special attacks, not a huge impact, but all bits count.

Melee DPS - 939.32 41% : white
Hemo DPS - 495.42 22% : SS / Hemo
Finisher DPS - 468.35 20% : rupture / evisc
Other DPS - 382.03 17% : windfury, poisons etc.

Here we go

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Q u o t e:

In effect, you can stack expertise or hit rating to the same effect point for point. However, once you are above 9% hit chance your special attacks should no longer miss. At this point expertise becomes the superior way for a rogue to ensure his attacks land on a mob. Expertise also reduces the chance your attacks would be parried, but since you should be standing behind your target dodge is really the only effect that a rogue will generally notice.

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Yeah because our special attacks are 20-25% of our damage(or 30ish for Backstab builds)the difference isn't so huge but still there is. And since Expertise is somekind of "rare" until next patch, getting as much expertise as possible(without gimping your gear by taking an inferior piece of course) will help.

It's pretty hard to get until 2.4, but the trinket from heroic magicster's terrace will be a great benefit.
It'll be a pain to farm though...

Cheers for the first post, helps with gear-planning.

God im looking forward to farming Magisters Terrace for the trinket, shame heroics can be done only once a day.