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Wryxian
Blizzard Poster
  • 20. Re: Buff the racials of underplayed races   16/10/2009 04:33:31 PDT
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Q u o t e:
P.S Wryxian, you sig is a reference to "Hook in mouth" by megadeth? :P
Nope, it's a reference to our very own Level 80 Elite Tauren Chieftain's song "I am Murloc!"

I am more than a fish,
I am more than a man!
Death will rise from the tide!
I am Murloc!


Though obviously a Crocolisk is even more than a Murloc! ;-)

"I am more than a fish, I am more than a man!"

Community Team - English
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  • Vek'nilash
  • 21. Re: Buff the racials of underplayed races   16/10/2009 04:38:04 PDT
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Q u o t e:
Nope, it's a reference to our very own Level 80 Elite Tauren Chieftain's song "I am Murloc!"

I am more than a fish,
I am more than a man!
Death will rise from the tide!
I am Murloc!


Though obviously a Crocolisk is even more than a Murloc! ;-)

Told ya :)
Well actually I just linked it but hey...xD

Proud citizen of what the Americans call "Dutchland"
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  • 22. Re: Buff the racials of underplayed races   16/10/2009 04:46:42 PDT
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Q u o t e:
Dwarves, gnomes, orcs, trolls.

Do it.


Orcs are an underplayed race? Seriously?

Orcish/common dictionary "BUR = An aggressively passionate mating call. "
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  • Argent Dawn
  • 23. Re: Buff the racials of underplayed races   16/10/2009 04:47:39 PDT
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Q u o t e:


Orcs are an underplayed race? Seriously?
Actually according to the Census website Orcs, Trolls and Tauren are all played about as much as Gnomes and Dwarves are. The Horde really is mostly made up of Blood Elves, with Undead a close second.

Shgla'yos plahf mh'naus.
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  • 24. Re: Buff the racials of underplayed races   16/10/2009 04:57:17 PDT
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I doubt racials are a major factor when new players choose their first character. Design of the races is a bigger factor imo.

I'm more concerned about more how experienced players will feel like they need to level new chars or use the upcomming race change feature to improve their performance in both PvE and PvP.

Taking humans as a example. How can you compare 3 sword/mace expertise (mostly useless) and 3% spirit (even more useless) to 1% damage or haste from the new races in Cataclysm?

And both orcs and trolls have pretty good damage boost racials compared to all other current races.

And have you noticed the huge wave of arena players changing to undead for Will of the Forsaken lately?
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  • Steamwheedle Cartel
  • 25. Re: Buff the racials of underplayed races   16/10/2009 04:58:13 PDT
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Q u o t e:
We are reviewing existing racials for Cataclysm, but it is our current opinion that after the changes we already made to racials that there isn't much needing to be changed at the moment.
I agree with the OP.

Humans are the most played race.
Humans have the best racials, even more when perception was exchanged for every man for himself.
Is that a Blizzard's goal to encourage players to choose mostly Humans?

Some racials that in my opinion need a change, besides already mentioned professions:
- all the "chance to be missed by X school spells", before known as "20 resistance to X school", I doubt anyone finds that useful, it's neither something "cool" you can use, nor a reliable racial trait you can count on;
- expertise with particular weapon, I think it was "more weapon skill" before but was changed, it's a bad racial because the game doesn't give you a choice to pick a particular weapon, in tier X a sword will drop, in tier Y an axe will drop, etc. You might want to be a Dwarf with a mace for the racial, looks or flavor reason, but if the raid drops a sword, you can't say "I'd like a mace instead".
- Dwarf Treasure finding, because you removed treasures first from Northrend and then from Outland;
- Orc Blood Fury doesn't work for healers, and this is sad. :(
- Troll Beast Slaying, another very narrow niched, situational racial, that is next to useless; HP regeneration is useless as well, but if it wasn't, it would be OP :(

I really have no idea why Humans should have better racials than anyone else?
For non-combat racials, Diplomacy is a huge benefit, the only coming close will be Goblin racial giving price discount in shops.
Why other races can't have something as cool?

In my opinion, cool racials are those that are actually helpful, and work for any class. Racials like +int aren't useful to a Gnome Warrior, maybe that's why I have an impression the majority of Gnomes are Mages. Racials like Bow Specialization are useless to Troll Mages, Shamans and Priests, and even Hunters can't count on it, because game designers might put a Gun drop and no Bows.

I'm not really a fan of Profession racials, because you want a profession that fits the class well and then you face the dilemma:
- lose racial profit
- choose unwanted profession
- choose different race for your class

For example you roll a Gnome Warlock and want to pick Jewelcrafting. You either:
- lose racial
- reroll Engineering
- reroll Draenei
This isn't fun.
Now it's not important, you just lose few points to skill up.
But when you buff professions racials, the loss can be much bigger, for example choosing Enchanting on your Goblin instead of Alchemy and not rerolling a Blood Elf with some "buffed" Enchanting racial. Because if a Goblin is an Alchemist he gets 15% to his potions and maybe Blood Elf enchanter gets better enchants?

The whole WotLK changes with profession bonuses balanced against each other was so we don't have another TBC when "clothies should pick tailoring". Don't bring this back with the racials so "Goblins should pick alchemy". Oh, you also didn't want people to pick certain races for OP racials, so you nerfed Tauren stamina racial and Undead's Will of the Forsaken.

I hope you didn't forget.
However...
I still remember what people were saying about Arena Tournament realms:
If you didn't face 3x Undead RMP you faced 3x Human RMP.
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  • 26. Re: Buff the racials of underplayed races   16/10/2009 05:06:48 PDT
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Q u o t e:

Humans have the best racials, even more when perception was exchanged for every man for himself.



How is Every man for himself the best racial? The only bonus you get in a PvP setting is an extra trinket proc, while other classes gains secondary CC breakers (in addition to their PvP trinket) like undeads and gnomes.

Undead:
WG trinket - 190 ap + Removes all CC
Battlemaster trinket - 256 ap + ~4600 last stand
Will of the forsaken - Removes fear, charm, sleep

2 CC breakers

Gnome:
WG trinket - 190 ap + Removes all CC
Battlemaster trinket - 256 ap + ~4600 last stand
Escape artist - Removes movement imparing effects

2 CC breakers

Human:
DPS trinket - 190+ ap + possible proc
Battlemaster trinket - 256 ap + ~4600 last stand
+ a slight stealth detect increase which might help you vs a fracton of arena matches

1 CC breaker (people tend to forget that EMFH shares CD with PvP trinket)


I'd take WOTF over Bandit's Insignia, Death's Verdict etc any day
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  • The Sha'tar
  • 27. Re: Buff the racials of underplayed races   16/10/2009 05:13:29 PDT
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Q u o t e:
Orcs are an underplayed race? Seriously?
Maybe because they have too few females, same as Dwarves.


Q u o t e:
buff gift of the naaru, and give me a reason why i wont go human for that overpowered racial
With the upcoming race change "going Human" might really become a trend, I see many people will rather pay for an immediate change than bother with rerolling from zero.


Q u o t e:
And have you noticed the huge wave of arena players changing to undead for Will of the Forsaken lately?
No.
Forsaken have always been "the pvp race". A lot of pvp-oriented people rolled Undead rogues, priests, mages and warlocks, only Warriors weren't as popular, because Warriors have class mechanics to drop fear, so Orcs were more popular choice due to anti-stun racial. Back then Orcs with racial + talent + meta had some ridiculous amount of stun resistance, now it's just shortening the stun, but still useful.

Now it might be overshadowed by the vast masses of pretty Blood Elves, but still Undead are more popular choice than Trolls or Orcs.
Tauren were chosen mostly because of the racial stun, HP bonus for tanking and the only Horde race for Druids.

The racials aren't meaningless cosmetic feature, why do people play Orc Warriors and Undead Rogues and not the other way around?

[ Post edited by Riesz ]

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  • 28. Re: Buff the racials of underplayed races   16/10/2009 05:20:11 PDT
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With the huge wave of new undead players, I ment people who roll from alliance to horde to get that racial. It's pretty much more powerful than any racial on alliance side atm. This is one of the things that causes larger imbalance between hordes and alliances on many realms.
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  • 29. Re: Buff the racials of underplayed races   16/10/2009 05:23:34 PDT
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Q u o t e:
Trolls do seem to be the least played though, well at least in the game, the forum is different though!


Well played, sir.

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  • 30. Re: Buff the racials of underplayed races   16/10/2009 05:27:12 PDT
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No matter how good the racials are, I still wouldn't play a cow - I want to play a race that stands upright (unlike most horde races), even if it is overpopular these days :).

It might help balance population a bit, but as said above, warriors will still mainly be orcs and taurens, not trolls - and rogues will still be undead not orc.

Edit: Damn Ouna ruining my point by posting on a troll warrior :P

[ Post edited by Serathil ]

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  • Draenor
  • 31. Re: Buff the racials of underplayed races   16/10/2009 05:27:30 PDT
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Does it really matter (except for some holidays where you have to find a troll warrior or dwarf paladin for an achievement) whether all races are played as often? I doubt the racials are the reason anyway. For instance, the Belf overload is because there currently is no other horde race that can be paladin, and a lot of people seem to choose their race based on looks and emotes. At least that's the impression I get.

After all, you can't spell slaughter without laughter.
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  • 32. Re: Buff the racials of underplayed races   16/10/2009 06:59:32 PDT
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Q u o t e:
Actually according to the Census website Orcs, Trolls and Tauren are all played about as much as Gnomes and Dwarves are. The Horde really is mostly made up of Blood Elves, with Undead a close second.
I bet for paladins the most played race is draenei, take a guess why ;)

For months I was the only troll in my guild 25-mans, lately 2-3 more have popped up in forms of new recruits. Random is random I guess


<- picked troll because they look cool, I had zero idea what racials were or that I even used to have race-specific spells back then. WTB shadowguard back!

[ Post edited by Hohounknown ]

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  • Defias Brotherhood
  • 33. Re: Buff the racials of underplayed races   16/10/2009 07:07:25 PDT
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Q u o t e:
We are reviewing existing racials for Cataclysm, but it is our current opinion that after the changes we already made to racials that there isn't much needing to be changed at the moment. The only possible changes I'm aware of currently may be related to professions -- so, purely for example, maybe Dwarves might get a bonus for the new secondary profession Archaeology.


Hi Wryxian,

I would like to say the dwarf racial "Find Treasure" could use a makeover. Atleast make it work for all quest items you have to locate which are on the ground :-)
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  • 34. Re: Buff the racials of underplayed races   16/10/2009 17:27:21 PDT
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Q u o t e:
We are reviewing existing racials for Cataclysm, but it is our current opinion that after the changes we already made to racials that there isn't much needing to be changed at the moment. The only possible changes I'm aware of currently may be related to professions -- so, purely for example, maybe Dwarves might get a bonus for the new secondary profession Archaeology.


Nice. Now give me race change plx <3
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  • 35. Re: Buff the racials of underplayed races   16/10/2009 19:12:15 PDT
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holy holland....youre not wiping because of racials ,youre wiping because 3 out of 10 didnt read tactics you racist bastards.!!!!

Randy:oh gosh is that you or the Liquor talking Mr Lahey?

Lahey: Iam the liquor randy.
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  • 36. Re: Buff the racials of underplayed races   16/10/2009 19:17:13 PDT
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Q u o t e:
We are reviewing existing racials for Cataclysm, but it is our current opinion that after the changes we already made to racials that there isn't much needing to be changed at the moment. The only possible changes I'm aware of currently may be related to professions -- so, purely for example, maybe Dwarves might get a bonus for the new secondary profession Archaeology.

Hi, my name is Treasure Tracking and I'm a useless Dwarf Racial.

Honestly. :( There's no chests in the wild of Outland, none in the Outland Dungeons, none whatsoever in Northrend either. Granted you'll spend 60 levels, or a bit less, able to Track Treasure but afterwards it's entirely useless. Think you can patch that through to the Devs somehow?

Miorum Dustmoore - [RP'er stuck on the wrong Server][Tank][Also, DPS]
Realism: Warriors making people walk slower by yelling at them.
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  • 37. Re: Buff the racials of underplayed races   16/10/2009 21:09:35 PDT
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Q u o t e:
How is Every man for himself the best racial? The only bonus you get in a PvP setting is an extra trinket proc, while other classes gains secondary CC breakers (in addition to their PvP trinket) like undeads and gnomes.


In PvE, it's probably the best tanking racial (possibly Melee DPS racial for alliance as well, for closing distances and doing more DPS). Snares and stuns are incredibly common in PvE, and for a tank to have such a trinket ability inately is extremely handy (because you learn to use it constantly). I used to enjoy my EA, but it's fairly tame in comparison.

Not sure it's the "best" racial, that's all relative to your class and what you're doing. But for tanking, Every man for himself ranks up there with the Tauren HP bonus (however nerfed it has become) IMO.

How to Be Nice : http://wow-europe.com/en/info/basics/benice.html
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  • Hellscream
  • 38. Re: Buff the racials of underplayed races   17/10/2009 07:08:41 PDT
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Q u o t e:

Gnome:
WG trinket - 190 ap + Removes all CC
Battlemaster trinket - 256 ap + ~4600 last stand
Escape artist - Removes movement imparing effects


Escape artist is useless in it's current state. It needs to add 5 second immunity to even be worth considering over any other races' ability.
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  • The Maelstrom
  • 39. Re: Buff the racials of underplayed races   17/10/2009 07:15:58 PDT
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For my orc shaman i love the racial, but its no use for resto spec :(

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